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New FDA Ruling

HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
«1

Comments

  • Same bs, next incremental grab by the libs.

    Every couple years they nibble away. Every freedom.

    Only laws that expand freedom are laws helping criminals, queers, and entitlement groups.

  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    This actually benefits cigarette companies. Anything released after October of 2007... Been alot of new cigars and pipe tobaccos. New blends every year, in fact. Not a whole lot of new cigarette bands out there. So far as cigars are concerned, I wonder if each vitola would count as a different product, requiring a new application. I anticipate a congressional rider on this, but still.
  • What is not mentioned is they need to reformulate a blend every few years just to stay consistent, as the crops change and it takes about 4 years to get the cigar tobacco fermented. Application costs would be passed along of course, pricing it out of reach for everyone but politicians and the rich.
  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    This was the Cigar Aficionado article, but the same laws apply to nasal and oral smokeless tobacco (nasal was actually specified this time).
  • MarkMMarkM Member
    @snuffsahoy - One thing that really makes no sense is that the FDA is regulating vaping devices and e-liquid as "tobacco products".  That's like regulating bicycles as automobiles.
  • IcepickIcepick Member
    edited May 2016 PM
    So basically a snuff maker has pay $100k more or less for each flavor they produced during the last 9 years to continue selling here? Sounds like Snuffaggeddon.
  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    @Icepick That's kind of what it looks like. @Roderick I'd Live to hear your thoughts B-)
  • Look forward to the inventory reduction sales
  • TobeTobe Member
    @snuffsahoy Indeed. Seems like a virtual certainty.
  • Can't see it as a problem for snuff. Snuff has been sold in the USA since the Mayflower. Besides Toque is only shipped to the US, it is sold in the UK.
  • MarkMMarkM Member
    @Roderick - good point.  To the best of my knowledge, the U.S. government does not have regulatory authority over foreign corporations.
  • No but it has authority over imports. Real cigars are virtually all imported, and they seem to be a target of this rule.
  • Read the writing on the wall. Buy all the tobacco you'll ever need for the rest of your days now. Don't worry, be happy with a fully stocked cellar. You can use it to buy something when the economy collapses.  
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • tboyertboyer Member
    edited May 2016 PM
    snuffsahoy

    Member







    "Only laws that expand freedom are laws helping criminals, queers, and entitlement groups."

    snuffsahoy, there are "queer" on this forum who don't appreciate being categorized with criminals. Let's
    keep snuffhouse one of the friendliest forums on the internet
  • Oh, that wasn't my intention to hurt anyone's feelings, it was just a statement of fact about the direction most of the globe in general and America in particular is going.

    Those groups are achieving greater rights, most other groups are seeing their rights chipped away. Simply an observation, I'm not trying to hurt feelings, so please don't take the statement in a manner it was not intended to be taken.

    Note: since a queer person is just a person they can fall into all those categories or none at all, or were you suggesting they are incapable of such a thing as taking entitlement or breaking a law? Of course not, don't go out of your way trying to be offended.

  • MarkMMarkM Member
    edited May 2016 PM
    @tboyer @snuffsahoy

    re: "snuffsahoy, there are "queer[s]" on this forum who don't appreciate being categorized with criminals."

    I second that.  This is a diverse community of different backgrounds, races, genders, ages, sexual orientations, and political affiliations.  I think if you have a problem with people who are different from you, it's best to keep that to yourself.  The world is divided against us tobacco users as it is; let's not be divided against each other.
  • tboyertboyer Member
    edited May 2016 PM
    snuffsahoy "Those groups are achieving greater rights, most other groups are seeing their rights chipped away. Simply an observation"
    "Only laws that expand freedom are laws helping criminals, queers, and entitlement groups."

    @snuffsahoy So snuffsahoy are you saying that "queers" have rights that heterosexual people don't ?
    Also some gay people would find your use of the term "queers" in this context to be offensive. Yes I know that gay people will use the term just as African Americans will sometimes use the term ni**er, but if you're not a member of that group you best be careful how you use that term
    As for me going out of my way to be offended...well you shouldn't go out of your way to offend 

  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    *blink*
    *blink*
    ...So one time, I started a thread about a new law so we could discuss it and how it may affect us, and when I checked back, guess what? It was a completely new thread altogether! Please, guys, I understand human rights is a contentious issue, but honestly, @tboyer @snuffsahoy do either of you actually envision the other ever A)conceding or B)apologizing on the point? If not then there is no point, and with no point we have no discussion. Only argument and enmity. Either of you is free to start a thread on the topic of gay rights, but please, this one is about the feds trying to steal my cookie!
  • =)) Well said H
  • TobeTobe Member
    I think @basement_shaman said it all. Buy all you can now, because when they pull the rug out from under you, it's going to be all of the sudden and with one swift tug.
  • I'd like to offer a moderating viewpoint. I have a lifetime supply of all these tobacco products, but the reason that I do is because of past hysteria. Long timers will remember such things as SCHIP, PACT, etc. With the advent of each of these new laws, the end of tobacco was seen as the quick and certain outcome. I'm not saying don't buy big, certainly prices will go up. But I suspect it's still quite a long road to black market tobacco.

    Just rambling, carry on.
  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    @Zanaspus I think you're spot on with that. I wasn't around for SCHIP, but I was around for PACT. The feds are always trying, but the Tobacco Lobby is crafty, and tobacco hobbyists are always able to find the new loophole for any new law. I guess that's more what this thread was intended for. I anticipate some turbulence this year (though not an outright halt) until we find out way around it again. The boutique cigar movement may well be dead, which is sad. Ventura, for example, was putting out some great sticks. The Project 805 Andullo was groundbreaking (though not talked about much). The interesting thing about this initiative is that it's the first time nasal snuff has been mentioned specifically.
  • They claim it's to protect our youth .but It is always about money.image
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • MarkMMarkM Member
    @Hitsuzen - I understand your desire to stay on-topic, and this is the last I'll say about it, but surely you do understand that the very first comment on this thread was one that could be taken as very offensive by some members of our community, and it was bound to come up in the discussion.  It's not even about gay rights specifically; it's about civil discourse.  If a comment contained a reference to "n****rs", would you have expected that to have gone completely unnoticed and unremarked upon?

    With that out of the way, I agree with you that a lot of the hysteria over the FDA deeming regulations is probably unwarranted, since there are always ways of getting around things.  And, perhaps more importantly, people are not going to take this lying down.  For example, just today NicoPure Labs (an e-liquid company) announced the first lawsuit in federal court against the FDA over the deeming regulations:

    https://www.nicopure.com/news/nicopure-labs-challenges-fdas-deeming-rule/

  • I wonder to what extent products are to be classified, and whether this is primarily to counter new forms of nicotine delivery. For example, cigars, cigarettes, pipe tobacco, chew and snuff were all obviously around well before 2007. Maybe the original intention was to legislate for new forms such as vape, disolvables, mouth sprays and other such innovations, rather than every new cigar or pipe tobacco bland that comes to market. Or maybe there is at least scope for interpretation in this way.

    What the hell do I know, I'm a Brit :P
  • MarkMMarkM Member
    @50ft_trad - since the deeming regulations mean that every new e-liquid formulation - every possible combination of nicotine strength and flavoring combination - has to approved as a "new product", I don't see why that wouldn't apply to every snuff flavor, or adjustment in the recipe, different vintages of cigar tobacco, different casing combinations for pipe tobacco, etc.  For example, even though cigarettes themselves have obviously been around since before 2007, if R.J. Reynolds wants to produce a cigarette with a new tobacco or flavoring blend, they have to go through the approval process all over again.  This is the case even without the new regulations.
  • How long untill these new regulations go into effect?
  • snuffsahoysnuffsahoy Member
    edited May 2016 PM
    Hey guys, feel free to pm me your issues personally, thanks.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/05/05/why-the-fdas-new-e-cigarette-regulations-are-a-gift-to-big-tobacco-and-could-actually-harm-public-health/

    Why not just smoke cigarettes?...

    Anyway it starts August 8
  • HitsuzenHitsuzen Administrator, Moderator
    @snuffywise Technically August 8th, but companies are allowed two years to submit, and afford up to one more for processing, so three years until we see whatever impact there may be.
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