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cutting down on snuff

nightcapnightcap Member
edited March 2009 in General
I can't believe it myself.

As of late I have been dealing with some aliments that I can only attribute to snuff use.
I am not a doctor, but I am able to research my symptoms and draw my own conclusions.
Within the last 6 months, I have increased the amount of pinches per day.
From 3 to at least 8
Also within this time I have experienced, high blood pressure, chest "pains" not really pains but.... chest feelings, and I have had an eye twitch that will not go away.
After a little research on the internet, I have learned all are related to overuse of stimulants.
tobacco being the only stimulant next to caffeine that I use.
Now, this pisses me off to no end because I enjoy snuff, and it allowed me to quit smoking for over a year now.
But it would appear that now there is yet another enjoyment that I have to cut down on.
If I have to quit wine, I'm going to lose it!!!!!
So for the last 4 days I have not used snuff at all, trying to purge what Nicotine may be left in my system.
Today was my first pinch of beautiful grapefruit.
God how I missed it!
The chest pains have lessened, the blood pressure has dropped, but still getting those damn eye twitches.
I guess like I've been told, too much of anything isn't good.
What freaks me out the most is................ I"M ONLY 30!
God help me for my physical next week.

I can use all the luck I can get people!


..........nightcap.
«1

Comments

  • Right, try to eliminate one thing at a time so you don't come to a wrong conclusion. Hope you feel better.
  • 3 to 8 pinches a day is nothing. I hardly think you are overdoing it. I probably do 3 times that much (or more) myself, and use other tobacco products as well. Consider that there may be other causes to your ailments. Also watch the salt intake for your high blood pressure.
  • I get an eye twitch from time to time. Annoying as hell.
    As for HBP and chest pains, I would guess you should see a doc.
    Good luck on the physical.
  • I would look at your caffeine and things like aspartame and MSG if you smoked before I think you would have noticed it before.
  • Myself, my BP is on the high side, but that's because I am too fat, and have metabolic syndrome, which means I should stop eating flour foods. But darn, that fine white powder is more addictive than anything, and if I die, it will be from that.

    Tom
  • Nightcap,

    I Prayed just now that you would pass your physical with flying colors!!!


    OK, I am not an MD, but I am a counselour - what you describe (high BD, chest pains, facial twitches, &c.) sound far more like symptoms of ’stress’ than it does ’over use of snuff’.

    I am NOT trying to make ’snuff’ come off as some guiltless party here, and it very well may be your problem - but 3-8 pinches of snuff a day (even with coffee) seems a rather low dose to cause such problems!!!

    I drink 10-12 cups of coffee per day, smoke 8-10 cigarettes, smoke up to 3 bowls of baccy in my pipe, and like Alex and Blue say, 3-8 pinches of snuff just gets me started (YES, I over-do baccy), but my point here is: You are describing ‘stress related’ symptoms to a ‘tee’!!!

    Do you ever have ‘racing thoughts’ with the symptoms you describe???! That would be a sure sign of ‘anxiety’. Time for a visit to the Doctor to get some ‘calming’ medication. Our minds can make us sick in ways where we blame everything but what is the true cause of our problems. I am NOT saying you are mentally distressed - but I am asking are you under an abnormal amount of pressure - something which has driven your stress-level far above normal.

    Even if you are (or have become) ‘nicotine intolerant’, you can always find some snuff with very low nicotine and enjoy that.

    I do hope you find the root of your problem and resolve it quickly - and again, ‘Best of Luck’ on your upcoming physical!!!!!!!
  • thanks for the replies guys..........
    Other then my alcohol intake.......... due to my profession of course.....wink
    I can't 'figure it out.
    The pains in the chest, I h8 to call them pains.
    They are a combination of a burning sensation, a tickle, and a cramp.
    All that I'm left with is the fact the nicotine is a stimulant, and stimulants can do things like this.
    About 6 months ago there was a thread about eye twitches.
    someone was talking about how they couldn't get rid of this twitch and it was driving then crazy.
    I only snuffing for half a year at the time told them they had nothing to worry about, and that it should go away in time and it had nothing to do with snuff.
    Well after reading up on eye twitches, they are caused by lack of sleep, and an increased amount of stimulants. ie nicotine, caffeine, any "non drowsy" med's.......
    So I have my theories.
    I'm not bad mouthing snuff in any way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I love the stuff.
    I guess I was seeing if anyone else had similar symptoms like myself.
  • I will not provide advice, but I think your doctor will. I think you should chat to him/her. I don't think members of a snuff forum are qualified to help. I hope you find an answer that puts your mind at rest. All I will say is that I suffer from bouts of anxiety and panic which often result in a variety of symptoms, such as chest pain, breathlessness, throat blockages, nausea and dizziness. They have come and gone since I was a teenager. I am beginning to learn to deal with them and suffer far less now. Good luck.
  • I hope I have not come across as someone pleading for help or bashing snuff.
    this was not my purpose.
    i was just wondering if anyone else has experienced the same symptoms as myself, and if they felt it was stimulant related.
    Although, I do thank everyone who has shared thoughts and given "best of luck".
    Tank you again.
    I'm still here and still snuffing.
    Just scratching the surface as it were.


    ...nightcap.
  • Have you tried taking more snuff to cure your ills? No joke. That funny tickle sensation you describe in your chest sounds to me very much what I feel when I crave a cigarette. I don't know how much you smoked when you did and never got addicted, or if you just smoked so often that the feeling never had a chance to come. However, since taking snuff and regulating my cigarettes to 2 a day, I find that I never get that chest itch feeling. You might well be having nicotine cravings and not realize it.
    Also the 3 symptoms you describe could all be unrelated to each other. Give it a little time and see if it persists. Our bodies have a way of sorting things out for us (at least the minor things).
  • Hi Nightcap, rest assured you are coming across as someone who's asking questions of those who have had experience with snuff and its effects upon them; it seems like the perfect place to pose such head-scratchers! I have to agree that discussing all of this with your doctor is the best course of action.

    For what it's worth, I'm good with the taking of nicotine through pipe smoking and snuff. Cigarettes are very disturbing to my system, and even the patch and gum are intolerable to me. The body is a funny thing.
  • I hope you don't mind if I add something here.

    Over the Christmas period I experienced almost exactly the same symptoms as you are describing. I was getting chest pains, palpitations and "strange" episodes where I felt like I was dying. A very unmerry Christmas.

    Eventually it was too much and I went to my doctor. He sent me for an ECG and they found nothing. So, as an extra precaution, they put me on a 24 hour ECG machine, still nothing. I went back to my doctor and he said that it seemed I had developed an anxiety disorder. He put me forward for counselling and cognative behavioural therapy.

    The way it seems to work is that the anxiety can get itself in to a closed loop. Here's how it worked with me. I'd get a palpitation (which everyone gets from time to time,) so I'd start to monitor my pulse. This would make me more anxious which would cause me to have another palpitation. This palpitation would confirm my worst fears and I'd monitor even more and my anxiety level would go up which would cause further physical symptoms. by this time I'm convinced that I'm going to die, so the symptoms get worse. So, around and around I'd go.....

    I have a pretty strssful job. Working in mental health isn't easy and I'm betting that your job isn't exactly sedentary either. Stress can get to the best of us.

    I'm not saying that you shouldn't go to see your doctor, you should. I'm also not claiming to be the anxiety guru, 'cause I'm not. I'm just saying that the mind can cause funny things to happen to person and that you may well have less to worry about than you may think.
  • @Mifnightmosesuk, you too!... glad (or sad) to hear i'm not the only one. for me it was kind of a side effect of taming my a.d.d. on my own but it is few and far between and also Xander i too find that it happens sometimes when i'm craving nic.
  • I had similar symptoms in the fall, when I was smoking cigars a LOT, along with nonfiltered cigarettes. I did seem to get into an anxiety loop over it, like what midnightmosesuk was mentioning. I did cut back on cigar usage, and that helped. But what also seemed to help was not worrying about it. Another thing was, I'd just quit drinking about that time, which accounted for quite a bit of stress. I still get minor pains here and there, but I try not to pay too much attention to them. As far as stimulants go, I think caffeine could eat nicotine for breakfast and still be hungry. I don't get headaches if I don't smoke, whereas I would probably get a migraine so bad I'd end up throwing up if I ever went a whole day without coffee. And I can smoke or take several pinches of snuff right before I go to sleep and not have a problem, which I can't exactly do with coffee. So, quit drinking coffee, and the wine should help cancel out any of the negligible ill effects of nicotine. ;)
  • edited March 2009 PM
    Nightcap, I take between 5 and 10 pinches per hour without any ill effects. I also drink to much coffee which does have a negative effect on me and I'm trying to cut down. I suffer from HBP and have 5 stents in my chest and one in my leg and I'm almost 65 years old.

    On the 17th of February I was tested for THREE HOURS as a check-up and everything was PERFECT. So, don't worry, be happy!!

    I wish you luck with your medical but try to calm down and not worry, otherwise the results might be bad. I agree with other posters that stess might be your biggest problem. One's body can play up in strange ways.

    In the meantime, DO NOT cut back on your snuffing 'cause doing so will make you feel WORSE.

    You are in my thoughts.
    Regards from South Africa
    Pieter
  • oaxacaoaxaca Member
    edited March 2009 PM
    Hmm you do not mention palpitations, rather chest pains, and no mention of panic attacks, Nightcap, so I'm not so sure it is an anxiety disorder (which I used to get too, had to go through that ECG procedure as midnight moses described; I thought I had heart disease or something lol!, turns out to be anxiety...). Anyway, as others have suggested, I think stress could very well be the problem...It seems to manifest in many diverse ways, depending on the person. Like you say stimulants probably exacerbate the condition, and the combination of caffeine and nicotine (remember nicotine levels are much higher in snuff than cigarettes) is fairly potent on the blood vessels (causing vasoconstriction and temporary high blood pressure). So a cut back is probably in order. I'd say diet plays a huge role in such matters too (low salt, low saturated fats, bla bla).

    I would like to just put on record though that the time I started drinking coffee and tea in large quantities (~age 19) coincided with the end of my palpitations ended (as well as migraines!). So i'm a big believer in caffeine being a salubrious alkaloid... but probably not when suffering from, or prone to, stress (same with nicotine).

    :)
  • Since starting snus and snuff, and quitting cigs my BP has actually went down. I am drinking less coffee, but I am surely getting more nicotine. I chain snus, and still use 2-6 pinches of snuff an hour, (small pinches compared to some of you hardcore guys). Point being, I would also advise looking at causes other than snuff/nicotine.
  • I have heard of people thinking they are having a heart attack, and going to the hospital, having chest pains, ect, and it's related to indigestion/gas, maybe there is an actual term for this, I don't recall. While I don't want to discount anything, as I am only a non-trained theorist, but the amount of snuff taken does seem very light. I am no way a big time snuffer, and I do more than that, and I have had hbp since before I started snuff, not too long ago. I have noticed a more stimulated feeling, and in my chest, and that may be nictoine, as it is a stimulant. Though it seems to have lessened, as I guess my body is getting used to it, as I am pretty new. But I have noticed different body effects from different methods of nicotine usage. I feel a good kick with snuff. Snus made me feel ill. Ciggs sometimes are nice, but then sometimes they are ugh, why am I doing this.

    Bottom line, IMO, if one does have feelings they are really concerned about, see a doc. Docs arn't perfect, and often I find them ignorant on many subjects, but if it's something obvious, it may be noticed. And if one believes it may be from a certain thing, take a break from it, or lessen it's usage, like do it so many times, at certain times. I know snus gave me heartburn and an upset stomach. The only "negative" I sometimes feel with snuff, is a sometimes stimulated feeling in my chest, that's not all the time, and I guess it can be expected to some degree, but that's mainly due to my uncontrolled diet, and condition created by, and I get it with coffee too.


    Just my rant, but don't risk your life by ignoring something(even though I probably would)
    Tom
  • Would 3-8 pinches even equate to a cigarette? have you tried different brands to see if they all have the same effect? It just seems unlikely that an ex smoker would be affected by such a small amount of nicotine, but I hope it works itself out so that you don't loose yet another pleasure.
  • GET A STRESS TEST!
    My symptoms were similar. My EKG's were all normal. Doc suggested a stress test. It saved my life. I was immediately taken to the hospital. After the stents were put in, and the nurse wasn't looking............A nice BIG pinch of Rooster laying right there in recovery! LOL!
  • Well guys,
    I've not gone to the doctor yet, but I've got down to 4 pinches a day and I do notice a difference.
    Perhaps for myself, I am sensitive to the means of nasal absorption of nicotine?
    Yes life is full of stress.
    But that IS life!
    My "unwind" is a glass(x3) of scotch and a pinch of what I've got going, plus what ever I'm listening to at the moment.
    I also find myself packing my Peterson Pipe with a VA/PER.
    That's a good unwind.
    My father always taught me to " step back from the forest and see the tree".
    I've done my investigations, and made my conclusions, and there is a bit of a difference.
    Perhaps for myself, large amounts of nicotine doesn't work?
    .........i was never a heavy smoker. maybe 4 smokes a week.
    Anyways, What doing is making a difference, and i plan to continue.
    i've not quit snuff, just cut down.
  • GLAD YOU ARE BETTER, Nightcap!!!

    Take care of yourself, and I Pray soon you are back to 100% health!!!

    LORD BLESS!!!!!!!
  • What gave me a nic OD was snus. Ugh, I felt terrible, sweating, nausas, just terrible. Smokes, cigars, snuff, even a lip of W.E. Garrett didn't give me any kind of feeling snus did, and I am glad. And I am glad, for I do like snuff, and an occasional smoke. Probably won't try Garrett in the lip again though, yuch.

    Tom502
  • bobbob Member
    I knew a guy that liked that feeling that tom discribes. He'd bum snus and snuff off me and smoke. He was crazy so that might explain the liking it. Yeah a couple of times I've felt like that and it isn't pleasant. Only happened once with snuff I said what happens if I snuff half this tin tonight (I was sixteen) it sucked also couldn't sleep that night (though I tend towards insomnia alot.
  • TOBACCO is the only source of nicotine. For four centuries or more it has been used for chewing, snuffing, or smoking, but no population has given up one form of tobacco use without replacing it with another. The only time the British gave up smoking was in the 18th century, when they switched to snuffing for almost a hundred years. The common factor is nicotine. There is no tar or carbon monoxide without combustion. Nicotine is absorbed through the lungs in cigarette smoking, through the buccal mucosa in tobacco chewing, and through the nasal mucosa in snuffing.
    What about snuff? Would it be a satisfactory alternative for dependent cigarette smokers? Snuffing is simply a matter of inserting powdered tobacco into the nose, and thus has two major advantages. Firstly, there are no products of combustion such as tar, carbon monoxide, and oxides of nitrogen. Secondly, it cannot be inhaled into the lungs, which eliminates any risk of lung cancer, which kills almost 30,000 British smokers a year. Would snuff provide enough nicotine to satisfy the dependent cigarette smoker? The historical evidence suggests that it could. We are studying the absorption of nicotine by cigar smokers and snuff users. Preliminary findings presented here show that the absorption of nicotine from snuff is very rapid; snuff could be sufficiently satisfying for cigarette smokers to switch to snuffing relatively easily.
    METHODS
    We measured blood-nicotine and blood-carboxyhæmoglobin (COHb) in cigar smokers and in snuff users.
    RESULTS
    Even with this form of non-inhaled cigar smoking, nicotine absorption was initially very slow.
    By contrast the absorption from a single pinch of snuff was extremely rapid.
    DISCUSSION
    The rate of nicotine absorption from snuff is very rapid. The blood-nicotine level of over 40 ng/ml matches the peak levels found in heavy cigarette smokers. Although the snuff user does not get the puff-by-puff high nicotine boli obtained by inhaling cigarette smokers, it takes the cigarette smoker about 10 min to reach a peak nicotine level compared with 5 min or less for a snuff user.
    Snuff may well be a satisfactory and acceptable substitute for cigarette smoking. In addition to its capacity to deliver nicotine, snuff could provide many other components of the smoking habit, such as a variety of aromas, attractive packaging, and intricate sensorimotor rituals which add to the pleasure and social aspects of the habit. Furthermore, it is likely to be acceptable to all social classes, since its present limited use ranges from velvet-curtained lounges to the depths of coal mines.
    Switching from cigarettes to snuff could have enormous health benefits. Although some problems could arise from continued absorption of nicotine and local nasal irritation in heavy users, the absence of tar and gases such as carbon monoxide, oxides of nitrogen, and many other toxic combustion products, would virtually eliminate smoking-related cancer, bronchitis, and possibly heart disease. Also, snuff does not contaminate the atmosphere for non-users.
    Our findings suggest that a new age for snuff is a feasible alternative to cigarette smoking. Snuff could save more lives and avoid more ill-health than any other preventive measure likely to be available to developed nations well into the 21st century.
  • JuxtaposerJuxtaposer Member
    edited April 2009 PM
    Firstly there is radioactive lead and polonium in tobacco. and secondly I'll bet your ass it gets in your lungs. But yes don't smoke, snuff Toque! The more you snuff, the less you smoke. Smoking is much worse than snuffing by far for all the reasons mentioned above. But don't expect to live for more than ten thousand years, or one hundred without any wear and tear for that matter.
  • In my case caffeine contributes much more to high BP problems than nicotine. I've wondered why it was always much higher at the doctors office than it was the evening before when I checked it at home. I finally put 2&2 together and realized that after drinking a few cups of coffee at home,I would go straight to the doctors usually drinking a cup on the way. I monitored it at home over the next couple days and after my morning coffee and snus (this before I found snuff) it would be in the pre-hypertension stage (140+ over 90+) and slowly return to normal within 2-3 hrs. I quit drinking coffee and the BP problems went away. It actually drops a little when I use snus,but rises a little when I snuff,maybe because of the rapid absorption rate. I don't worry about that because my normal BP is on the low side. I loved coffee and went through a few days of nasty headaches after quitting but I was happy it wasn't my snus and snuff causing it.
  • Tobacco is not the only source of nicotine. Nicotine is a toxin used by plants of the Solenaceae family (which includes tobacco, tomato and pepper plants) as a self defence mechanism. Tribes in Peru smoke dried wild tomato leaves for their nicotine. Don't try it at home though, the flavour is repulsive apparently.
  • Sandy, wonder what snuff made from dried tomato leafs will be like?
  • I'll take mine in spaghetti sauce, thank you!
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