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The new EU regulations could be avoided

When tax is so high and all the red-tape so burdensome it hampers economic activity, business owners have but two choices. That is, either to pack up and stop trading or relocate somewhere else and resume all manufacturing activity in a friendlier country with less regulations. Both Switzerland and Norway have trading agreements with the EU despite the fact being outside of the political union, so I was wondering if it was possible to move out and relocate to those countries as to avoid the new EU regulations on snuff and tobacco products. The other option is to wait and see whether or not Theresa May will invoke article 50 in the end. 


  • Isle of Man or Channel Islands would be possibilities.....
  • That is a good point. And I don't think you have to physically relocate to be able to trade. I am not sure, but I think all of have to do is register over there.
  • Isle of Man would be great, it'd give me a chance to visit the factories once a year during the race.
  • Or could they do a snuff subscription/wholesale service , snuff gets made when a certain threshold is met , different snuffs at different times.
  • Keep these ideas coming. They are all good and by brain sharing we might get a work around. 
  • I find it difficult to understand how moving outside the oppression zone will allow you to sell back into it. Considering how protectionist the Eurofraud Union is, it seems most unlikely they would penalise EU producers over external producers. Even if there is such a loophole, I can't imagine it existing for long.

    I would hate to see our snuffmakers incur great costs to establish new facilities, only to have the door slammed shut on them, or be hit by fines. By all means it should be explored, but I would consider investing in legal input from a qualified EU legal professional before indulging in such outlay.

    If it does work, maybe there would be the potential of a British Snuff Collaborative. Snuff mills could receive their raw materials and grind them (partial processing - not ready for consumption). They could also produce the scenting formulations (non-tobacco). The various elements could then be sent to the British Snuff Collaborative on the Isle of Man for scenting, fermentation, and packaging. This means that individual mills can protect their formulations, and still control the processes and their own business, whilst maximising market potential for a wide range of brands to keep the wider industry alive until laws can be reverted back from the Eurofraud dictatorship.

    If restrictions are still incurred on the mills under this arrangement. Only base snuffs will be affected, needing registering with only one country (UK), and only in one size (by the barrel). Home scenting kits would be the next logical step if the door was slammed on this project, and the base snuffs could be sold to the users in only 25g and 500g configurations. Again, scenting could be sold separately as a non tobacco product.

    There was talk of cigars being exempt due to their being less popular, and not impacting on SMEs. Could "karotten snuff" gain exemption as powdered cigars? Clutching at straws, I know, but we need to consider all options.

    Sticking with grasping at vagaries, would there be scope for registering florals (for example) under one product classification? Base snuff ingredients along with all floral additions listed on the registration, with the mills specifying that the scenting application varies according to natural variations of the raw leaf. Toque Flora would then be a single product with wide reaching variations .... if you catch my drift :-\"

    I just wish we'd had the chance to get out of the clutches of Brussels before this sadistic act kicked in :-<
  • Label Snuff as bug poison.  Or bee sting and insect bite relief or one of the many other uses for tobacco.
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • Or be innovative and label it dental snuff...
    ;) basement_shaman put it right.this is the road I guess
  • How does it work with resellers?  Like, if Toque sells to Snuffstore in the UK, and Snuffstore sold to customers in other EU countries, would Toque still need to pay the fees in all the other EU countries?  If they're not selling directly?
  • cpmcdillcpmcdill Member
    edited November 2016 PM
    Based on what I've read, although the Isle of Man is exempt from EU regulations, getting goods manufactured on the Isle of Man to any other EU nation, including the UK, or anywhere else, could be tricky. Also, one would need to make sure that the Manx government hasn't passed its own tobacco control laws.

    Also, according to the Wiki article, it seems EU citizens can visit or reside on the Isle, but only hereditary Manx may be employed there (others subject to all sort of restrictions or something to that effect).

  • Here's an idea:  The snuff manufacturers only produce the large sizes, and only sell them in their country of origin.  And snuff users organize into buyers' clubs.  10 people go in on a 250g tub of their favorite; one person buys it from a shop in the country of origin, divvies it up, and sends out the portions to the buyers.  

    Or... resellers themselves couldn't do that, could they? Buy a large quantity from the manufacturer, then repackage it into smaller containers for sale?  Tobacconists can buy cigars by the box and sell them individually. 
  • MrSnuffMrSnuff Administrator
    I want you all not to worry too much. 

    I will find a legal way around this, that I guarantee you. If need be I will open a second small warehouse outside the EU and sell from there.

    The only issue is will the snuff manufacturers buy into it, or will they keep their heads stuck in the sand and simply stop producing the snuffs that don't sell that well. 
  • I keep having this nagging feeling that the best course of action might be education. Explaining to whoever gets to make these choices why snuff shouldn't be treated in the same way that cigarettes or other tobacco products are. The problem isn't a stance of fuck tobacco but health and business issues that are real (we can debate their value, but they do have some legit points). Applying these rules to snuff doesn't achieve the aim of these regulations it's a very bad side effect. The fact is these rules when applied to snuff go against the basic premise of the E.U. and actually damages part of Europe's history and regional charms.
     I could be totally wrong but it's what my gut keeps telling me that if we can find the right people and make this basic case eloquently and strongly enough that might be the most powerful thing we can do. The thing is at worst it would be wasted effort. So anyone know who to write?
  • @bob you can thank big tobacco for all these new regulations on all harm reduction products. They want to sell their cancer sticks and have the money to buy every government official to crush the competition. I think big pharma also has their nose in it. harm reduction isn't in their profit forecast. They want people to get ill so they can sell drugs. Tax man wins either way.  
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • @bob I've written to my MP and all my local MEPs. As a snuff user, rather than someone in the industry, I feel I've kind of maxed out on who I can personally approach, although if I can think of anyone else, they'll be hearing from me too. The more UK members who write to their local representatives, the higher the chance of this being officially considered and debated at a level that can effect positive (for us) change to the system.

    Unfortunately, at this moment in time, we are still under the dictat of Brussels, and with important negotiations on the horizon, our guys and gals are not going to want to ruffle any more feathers than necessary with their guys and gals. Brexit hasn't happened yet, it hasn't even started yet, and is going to take a minimum of two years to negotiate and enact. We may indeed get some delay, or even some concession, in respect of the TPD's effect on snuff on UK law - but we are not yet in a position where we have full control of our own laws.

    As to influencing and educating the EU - forget it! Unless of course you can give them bigger "incentives" than Big Tobacco can.
  • If I was a British official I would argue that these regulations were created SOLEY to destroy Britians oldest companies and heritage as punishment for leaving the EU.
  • They destroyed our fishing industries as punishment for JOINING .....

    They've screwed up plenty of other things along the way too. The one I quote most is the fire extinguishers. They all used to be different colours, so you knew exactly which to go for in the heat of the moment (pardon the pun). You knew to grab a cream one if it was a liquid fire, red if organic, black if electrical, or blue if it was a combination..... now they're all red! So now you either have to look for a small coloured panel, or read the damn thing..... in a smoke filled room!

    Supposedly this makes things safer, as Europeans are all presumed to be too stupid by those in charge, to know it is a fire extinguisher if it isn't red. Of course, everyone could have adopted our wonderful system, but as it's cheaper for the member nations to force us to downgrade our systems rather than upgrade theirs, we have to suffer..... again
  • so who in Brussels would we talk too? I am not thinking anyone has to listen to us but maybe they can listen to reason. That's what I was thinking.
  • Honestly @bob and I don't mean this flippantly, I don't think anyone really knows how it all works - citizens, press, even some of the people that work in it. Good luck figuring out where to even start.
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