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Green Snuffs

horus92horus92 Member
edited May 2013 in Types of Snuff
I've heard scattered references to Green snuffs used in Russia and Eastern Europe. A search on google books turned up some references, which all stated it was extremely strong and fine and would "bring even old men to tears".

Does anyone have any information on this? Is it still made by anyone? And why the hell was it green? Sounds like my kind of snuff :D

Comments

  • For example - Russischer Augentabak what means "russian eye tobacco", because it was so strong that - as you said - "it was bringing to tears". There is also a book about this written by Stefan Monhardt, but I have no idea where the hell could you get this from.

    But they weren't exactly green. They were light brown. Finely milled and wet.

  • tybalttybalt Member
    I doubt it's commercially available anymore. I certainly have never seen it.

    Green tobacco isn't all that unusual, although one generally only sees it in cigars. Here's a write up from cigar afficionado that gives some background and explains how candela (green wrapper) is produced:

    "A green shade of wrapper tobacco achieved by a heat-curing process that fixes the chlorophyll content of the wrapper while it's still in the barn. Also referred to as double claro. From about 1958 to the early 1970s, Americans smoked billions of cigars, and nearly all of them were candelas. They were so popular in the United States that the term American Market Seletion (abbreviated as AMS) was created by the major importer of Cuban cigars at the time to designate green or candela colored wrappers.

    To make candela, a tobacco barn (or casa de tabacco) has to be properly prepped. The walls of the wooden barn are wallpapered with cardboard or paper to seal the cracks. The barn is loaded with freshly harvested tobacco, and the vents at the bottom of the barn are opened, encouraging air to flow out of the roof vent (known as a doghouse), which is always open. The propane heaters or charcoal fires are lit, and the heat slowly rises, taking the moisture out of the leaves. "The objective is to get air flowing through the tobacco, up and out of the doghouse," says Gustavo Cura, the operations administrator for Oliva Tobacco Co. in Tampa, which grows candela in Ecuador and Honduras. "The heat has to start slowly." Within two hours, the heat will be at about 90 degrees, and by hour No. 3, it will rise to 100. After 40 to 48 hours, the tobacco has wilted. The leaf is dry at this point, save for the stem, which takes much more coercing to dry out than the rest of the plant. The farmers shut the bottom vents in the barn and crank the heat to 165 degrees to remove the remaining moisture from the stem. This final step lasts for about one day, and bakes the tobacco as dry as a potato chip. After 60 to 72 hours total in the barn, the chlorophyll has been locked in the leaf and the tobacco is done heating, but needs to be rehumidified so it can be safely removed from the barn. Workers open the barn's vent doors and windows (unless it's windy), allowing the nighttime dew to make the crispy leaves moist again; if the climate is too dry, they bring in a steamer. Then, the leaves are taken down, sorted and graded, and put into boxes, ready for storage or for rolling. The fire curing eliminates the need for fermentation and aging, cutting months and even years off the typical process.

    Sunlight will make candela leaf lighter, while heat will darken the color. Candela wrapper can't be stored in normal tobacco warehouses; instead it's kept refrigerated. Water can stain it, so a roller has to know what he's doing in order to make a candela cigar by hand. Because it's the process that makes candela, rather than the seed or country of origin, candela wrappers are grown in a host of countries."
  • JuxtaposerJuxtaposer Member
    edited May 2013 PM
    @horus92 From the Bernards website

    "The north and east parts of Germany for example prefer the green tobacco, which are sorts like the "Kownoer", "Russischer Augentabak" or "Erfrischungstabak". These tobaccos are based on fermentation and milling of green tobacco west prussian (in further times also Polish and Russian) provenience. The original term "Kownoer" still reminds of this origin."

    So I would conclude that the snuff was not necessarily green in color but that uncured green leaves were used in the making of it.

    Furthermore Perique tobacco is made with partially cured leaves and I would speculate that the Perique method of fermentation may also suit fresh or wilted leaves just as well.
  • FilekFilek Member
    I've got the booklet "Russischer Augentabak" by Stefan Monhardt. It not that much of a snuff book, but a diary of a guy who want to get his hands on the no longer produced snuff from Bernard - Russischer Augentabak. On page 14, we can find some word from the specialist on snuff from Poland who said:

    "More interesting about Russicher Augentabak is the fact that this snuff was one of the last green snuffs available on the market. The last one of course is Kownoer made by Bernard. But the German version of both don't really have much to do with the oryginal Russian and Kowienska snuffs, which were more dry and were very grinded.
    The term "russisch" doesn't have much to do with the tobacco. It's another term for "green snuffs". The origin of this type comes probably from Russia, but the production of those was very common also in Poland-Lithuania and Germany. Anyway the term "green" comes from the process of fermentation in which the nicotiana tabacum recieves a green color. From the desription from and old Polish book, those snuffs should be strong like gun powder".

    The note from Bernard website also comes from the same guy from Poland... that means me.
  • XanderXander Member
    lol @ Filek =D> :))
  • FilekFilek Member
    I also have some other theories on this type of snuff, but I won't say a word, since I still need something cool for my own book, which I hope to finish this year. I've even found a publisher that might by interested in it, so I might even ask him (if everything goes fine) about an English translation of the text. But I'm sure the translation would be hard, since it's based on quotations, to prove my statements and with a lot of footnotes.

    Just to correct my previous statement with the 'green color'. Altrough nicotiana tabacum is recieving a greenish color, the green snuffs, are actually brown. It's because this tobacco is just the base, and is being mixed with at least one more. Like in Bernard's Kownoer you can see at least three kinds of tobacco.

    Ok, I won't be secretive. My theory on 'green snuff' is based on the Polish naming of this snuff - 'bernardynka'. That's what we called a special snuff made in monasteries in XVIII century Poland made in Częstochowa and Kowno (also other monasteries, but I won't name the others, for certain reasons). As all snuff-taking Poles know both were very similiar (thanks to the Polish epos "Mr. Taduesz). That's a clue. And since there is also a legend about the most famous snuff producer from todays Poland - named Goldfarb, that recieved the recipe on Kownoer form a monastic from Kowno, it's quite 'obvious' that he continued the work of religious monks. But...

    I've found an note about an other monatery, saying a bernardynka as some kind of mixture. If anyone has some interest in "sacrum beers" than that would be a bit troublesome, since a lot of this special drink made in monasteries is made differently. So, for now, I would guess that the special method of fermenting the 'green snuff' was originaly discovered by the monks from Kowno, and the later snuffs made the production method are based on that.

    Actually the term 'russish' comes from the XIX century, because the Russians wanted to have the whole glory - after the partition of Poland, Kowno was part of Russia.
  • Yet another theory. I'm focusting on my book and something felt strange. The Polish term isn't "Russischer", which all you think is "Russian", but refers to the old forgotten Polish voivodeship, called 'ruskie'. So probably Russia doesn't have any connotation with the green snuffs.
  • The only green snuff I had is Sceletium tortuosum ,non tobacco a mood-altering substance, Pack a healthy burn factor also for just a herbal snuff. Never experienced any effects, probably need to grow your own and make it fresh.
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • XanderXander Member
    edited August 2013 PM
    That's kanna, right? Nicotine Rush's partner store sold it. I tried it. It seemed pretty fresh. Still have not finished my 10g smash box. I suppose it has lost some potency over time as I only use it a couple times a month. I did and still do notice the effects, but they are not and never were drastic.
  • edited July 2016 PM
    Coincidentally searching info for other post just found one reference to
    green snuffs in the Spanish RAE (Language Royal Academy in spanish) to
    some "Tabaco Verdin" meaning "Greenish Tobacco" it goes like this: http://dle.rae.es/?id=Yr2tSiJ

    tabaco
    verdin (Greenish Tobacco)

    1. m. tabaco de polvo, que se elabora con las hojas de esta planta, pero sin compostura y cortadas antes de madurar.
    (Powdered tobacco, made from the leaves of this plant but without -not
    sure but here "compostura" maybe can be traslated as mix- and cut before
    they reach maturity.

    It especifically cites
    "powdered" so some type of "green" snuff was known here in Spain at some
    moment not sure exactly when...  

  • Rosinski Driesener has a greenish color.
  • snuffvilliansnuffvillian Member
    edited July 2016 PM
    Thanks to @Wulfensteinsson for introducing "Tabaco verdin", which was possibly the oldest forerunner of the green snuffs.

    Elaborated in Cuba, in Guines (diaeresis on "u") Valley specifically, it was a highly
    regarded variety of "Tabaco Polvo" (Spanish snuff) in Spain and other
    European Countries. It was only produced in that part of Cuba, so its
    leaf type and climate imparted some uniqueness to the tobacco
    fermentation process. It is known that this "Verdin" leaf "had thick branch, was full-bodied, and dried faster,
    being well suited to easy milling", so that was a very productive, high
    quality and flash-dried leaf.


    It was said in XIX Century that "Guines
    produced a bad tobacco for smoking but excellent for snuff". It was so
    from 1690 up to the end of XIX century.


    Sadly, "Verdin" production in Guines ceased a long time ago... the same as all the cuban snuff tradition.
  • sixphotosixphoto Member
    edited July 2016 PM
    Hello All,

    We have developed a new green nasal snuff for a customer in South America..It shall be available soon on Mr. snuff .in 30 g tins
  • Thanks to you @snuffvillian for the extra information about the Tabaco Verdin, one of the things I like most of this forum are the contributions like the one you just made, uncovering the history of snuff one bit at a time =D>
  • Dholakia Green is ready for dispatch to Mr. Snuff Warehouse.
    dhl-green-ziper-pouch
  • What is it like?
  • edited July 2016 PM
    @Jernej I have some on the way I will PM you my review of both.

     I despise  when people use my review and then tell me that I wouldn't mind. I will also post it on Face book snuff forums but not here. I don't write reviews for $ 0.20 of points that I never get a chance to use and I really hate when I get nothing. I am all about ego deflation.

     In the words of Frank Zappa
     " I've got troubles of my own, I said
    And you can't help me out
    So, take your meditations and your preparations
    And ram it up your snout"




    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • edited August 2016 PM
    This came in the mail today Dholakia Green.
    I won't review until I finish the 10G bag. but what I can tell you it is green tobacco. It is Medicated reminds me of Dholakia No.10 but not as sharp.

    That's right up my alley. Shaman Recommended!20160806_144637
    My knowledge is worthless if not shared and applied . "Joseph McKenna"  
  • 786  That looks right up my alley too!

  • I belive Dholakia Green is available to order from Mr. Snuff but I can't seem to find the link.

    Could please @Mr Snuff assist in directing the link for customer to buy Dholakia Green and New Herbal Snuff Products.

    Regards
    Manit Joshi
  • @manit_joshi is it fresh picked and dehydrated leaf? Must be, it's not too raw tasting?
  • JernejJernej Member
    edited August 2016 PM
    Rosinski Nordisch Grun is another green snuff.
  • @snuffsahoy Yes it is freshly picked natural plain green tobacco.

    It is now available to Order from Mr. Snuff website

    https://mrsnuff.com/dholakia-green-p-3827.html

    Regards
    Manit Joshi
  • @Manit_Joshi, do you still produce Dholakia Green?
  • This Dolokia Green looks like the texture of their Herbal line of Tobacco-free snuffs (which are amazing by the way!) And I hope it is still available as well. Green snuffs are a bit different but really like Green Dragon and the Rosinski Green.
  • I woul love to try some Dholakia Green.

  • Love me some non-matured rustica, I really enjoyed my homemade from big green leaves 8-}
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